Decent rotary machine recommendations

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Mr.Martian on Fri May 20, 2016 12:42 pm

So, I've only ever used coils (started off hand poking), and now I only own one machine (a sharpz microdial). I only do line work with some colour packing, very little shading, and all black!

It seems most the artists i appreciate or get tattooed by tend to use rotaries..

Given this info, can anyone suggest a decent rotary for this use? I know it's probably a minefield, and admittedly I know close to zero about rotaries.

I say 'decent' because I was pissing about with crap cheapo coils for a while and think in retrospect it held me back. I'm sure others will rightly point out a good tattooer can use any machines! but I'm not good yet, and better equipment seems to help the learning process - I saw a big difference when I got the sharpz!

Cheers
avatar
Mr.Martian

Posts : 43
Join date : 2016-05-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by tyler300888 on Fri May 20, 2016 5:03 pm

I use coils mainly but do own a couple of rotaries. Iv got 2 dragonfly clones that cost a couple of £ on ebay that I use for shading/packing and also a Chinese copy of the stealth for lining. 
I dont use them that often but can say that they are very good for the prices I paid for them. 
I know what your saying about using good coils after using a cheapy one, My line work improved after buying a microdial. 
Maybe If I used a genuine stealth or dragonfly I would see a difference like I did with my sharpz. 
I know im not really answering your question because I dont know that much about rotarys myself but maybe You should just try a cheapy one first to see How it feels. I prefer the feel and sound of a coil machine. 
Im sure some one who has experience with them could shed more light.
avatar
tyler300888

Posts : 215
Join date : 2016-05-12
Location : The wet welsh valleys

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Ketchup Kid on Fri May 20, 2016 5:48 pm

my experience is very limited, but after trying one rotary. i knew i had to switch.

i really don't have money to spend but i can say i got an experience of what using a rotary was like when i got a storm ($100 clearance). its a low end but not clone that competes with the stealth (supposed to be better) pretty smooth. once you feel it, and how different the voltage knob works you will get an idea of rotaries. i should mention it burnt out after first 2 hours of use... this is the nature of rotraries. i replaced it and seems okay so far.

since then i've bought dragonfly clones, and a prodigy clone, both do work and are worth having around, even though i don't trust them much and they are shameless knowckoffs. they are built cheaply with casting marks, misalignment and the usual chinese antics but you can get one to run.

you gotta be careful about which you buy because it is the most copied model in the business. Lou had put up a link somewhere on the site you can search for and she said she's tried and can vouch for them.

couple days ago i took the leap and ordered a rotary work aluminum version with money i don't have. they also come highly recommended and look really cool too. know to be solid machines. excited, wonder how long it will take these bloddy wanker to get up off their bums and get my order outs.

i'm determined to not use coils anymore except maybe my liner. i started tattooing with a jailhouse rotary, so the time i spent tuning coils thinking it was the the real way to go, wasn't helpful in my case. overall the most frustration part of a coil machine is the front spring. thats what i think anyway.

if money is no option the spektra halo seems popular,
and anything with cartridges is also what people may reccomend to you,
but those should left to people that know more and own the high end rotaries, and i'm just speculating at this point.
avatar
Ketchup Kid

Posts : 301
Join date : 2016-05-04
Age : 37
Location : Southern West Coast U.S.A. 818/213

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by UlfrMunr on Fri May 20, 2016 6:35 pm

I don't have much experience with rotaries but I recently got one from my work that was ordered from the piercing pros site and it's one built by them. It only costs $20 and I haven't run it that long or tried it on real skin but I really did like the feel of it. I'm going to do a tattoo on myself tomorrow using it so I'll update with the results from that session Smile
avatar
UlfrMunr

Posts : 38
Join date : 2016-05-04
Age : 30
Location : Tijuana, Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Loulou on Fri May 20, 2016 6:48 pm

if you want a good liner i would say rotary works , bas bazzi , ir demitri cherchenko , if you want to spend a bit less try starr they make rotaries for under 100 quid i have just brought one to try ,

in my opinion anything you can line with you can pack with as well and shaders look for df clones they make great shaders
avatar
Loulou
Admin

Posts : 491
Join date : 2016-05-02

View user profile http://bestattooforum.forumotion.co.uk

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by gaztred on Fri May 20, 2016 6:58 pm

My recommendations have already been mentioned above. Rotary works, I have 4 of these standard brass and aluminium. An id liner with needle crane and mk 2 springer ultimate warrior. All are great machines and with lifetime guarantee you can't go wrong. Also have a Ronnie Starr dd which is a good colour packer and super smooth. Couple of dragonfly clones to complete my rotaries. Would love a real McCoy DF though. On the coil side, I have had many but the only one I have kept is a Bov Williams.
avatar
gaztred

Posts : 100
Join date : 2016-05-04
Age : 49
Location : Bucks

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by rustysnow on Fri May 20, 2016 7:10 pm

I have a Welker rotary 3.8 and absolutely love it for lining and packing, i bought it direct from eternal tattoo supplies and it's a decent price for the quality http://www.eternaltattoosupply.com/Welker-Rotary-Machine_p_574.html

rustysnow

Posts : 38
Join date : 2016-05-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Ketchup Kid on Fri May 20, 2016 7:13 pm

have you guys seen the rotary works site lately? they are almost out of everything!!

i shopped 2 nights ago and settled for the retro aluminum anodized. i hope i made a decent choice, it was slim pickings. i also hope i chose the right throw 3.5mm. any feedback would be appreciated.

avatar
Ketchup Kid

Posts : 301
Join date : 2016-05-04
Age : 37
Location : Southern West Coast U.S.A. 818/213

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Mr.Martian on Fri May 20, 2016 7:21 pm

Cheers all! I'm gonna go look up the suggestions.

One thing that does appeal is definitely the lack of tuning and maybe the possibility to have an 'all in one', as what I'm doing is minimal, bigger lines and small amounts of colour packing.
avatar
Mr.Martian

Posts : 43
Join date : 2016-05-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by marked 4 life on Fri May 20, 2016 8:39 pm

Dont forget a k art for budget price machines http://www.akart.co.uk/

marked 4 life

Posts : 92
Join date : 2016-05-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by head on Fri May 20, 2016 11:11 pm

i hated rotary works but thats just self preference...theres a ton of rotarys out there its all trial & error...1 of the best i thought was a bishop which can do everything.
avatar
head

Posts : 202
Join date : 2016-05-07

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by marked 4 life on Fri May 20, 2016 11:32 pm

I really like my Wayne Taylor's, I had 2 RW brass machines and found them too fiddly and too noisy then messy once you oil them to make them quieter, Wayne Taylor's are not cheap but just feel so right and the customer service is great, Wayne always has time to speak to you with any queries etc.

marked 4 life

Posts : 92
Join date : 2016-05-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Ketchup Kid on Sat May 21, 2016 12:12 am

jesus christ so many brands out there,

the market is saturated as bad as the portable vape market

i used to have an atmos but now i use a flowermate hybrid for dry flowers
might get a arizer or da vinci one day, or maybe not...$$$
sorry went off topic, what r we talking about?
avatar
Ketchup Kid

Posts : 301
Join date : 2016-05-04
Age : 37
Location : Southern West Coast U.S.A. 818/213

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by No Quater on Mon May 23, 2016 11:42 am

I tried the bishop, neotat og and vivace, ego overkill(for sale), Emillion, halo, prodigy and rotary works plain brass mk2, tripple conrod and mk2 slimline. All i have left are the plain brass mk2 and TC both set up with the 4.2 cam for solid color. For shading i went back to coils. The TC i use most, it kicked the vivace and bishop from my arsenal.

Anybody got a spare 3.5 cam for a mk2? i lost mine? Willing to trade for a 4.2.

No Quater

Posts : 30
Join date : 2016-05-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Mr.Martian on Mon May 23, 2016 11:51 am

Those Stingray x2 (4mm) machines look great for lining and packing, just what I'm looking for, dead pricy though.
avatar
Mr.Martian

Posts : 43
Join date : 2016-05-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Mr.Martian on Mon May 30, 2016 8:59 pm

gaztred wrote: On the coil side, I have had many but the only one I have kept is a Bov Williams.

Cheers for that coils tip too ( I'm diverging here I know) , his stuff looks brilliant. What sort of machine is it?
avatar
Mr.Martian

Posts : 43
Join date : 2016-05-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Whippet on Tue May 31, 2016 11:35 pm

marked 4 life wrote:Dont forget a k art for budget price machines  http://www.akart.co.uk/

I just looked at these machines, they are reasonably priced and offer a short(er) stroke at 2.5mm, so I could be tempted for dabbling with a rotary for lining (??). Lou you line with a rotary right? Your linework always looks tight.

Anyone used them and can offer and advice on quality / performance etc?
avatar
Whippet

Posts : 149
Join date : 2016-05-04
Location : UK

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Ketchup Kid on Wed Jun 01, 2016 7:23 pm

i'm new to rotaries

the ak prices looks good, but are all direct drive.

logic, based on physics tells me direct drive is gonna wobble and make the needle unstable.

its just my theory, please correct me if i'm wrong...

you may wanna look into all the different styles of rotary before you commit. there's even ones that come with different stroke size cams.

i wanna line with a rotary someday also but its gotta be top notch machine proven for good lining to replace my coil liner that i really like, being as how lines are supposedly the weak point of rotaries.
avatar
Ketchup Kid

Posts : 301
Join date : 2016-05-04
Age : 37
Location : Southern West Coast U.S.A. 818/213

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Whippet on Sun Jun 05, 2016 1:11 am

Not adding to the buying decisions but tonight I set up a rotary instead of a coil to practise lining. Its a no-name £30 effort that I bought and ignored until now. The lining was smoother than I'm getting with coils, though hand speed had to drop.

I remembered that I also had a Stigma Bizarre clone that came as a used job lot - I was actually after the two coils in the kit, anyway...

I set this thing up and fuck me, how smooth and easy to line with.

Maybe I'm missing something, as I'd written off rotaries as a tool for people fed up with machine tuning....but now I'm thinking differently. The throw on both machines is long, but still easier to line with than a coil (for me at least). I was at the Northampton convention today and at least half the artists I saw were using rotaries...lots of Cheyennes kicking around.

I did two little pieces. The anchor with the £30 machine, shaky on the right side where I started but then started to come together. I literally threw the shading in with an 11MC that was way too big.

The flowers I did with the Stigma clone and IMO much better throughout. Leaf veins deliberately light.

Problem seems to be too many rotaries to choose from scratch

Reset: Did your RW arrive yet? If so how's it playing?


avatar
Whippet

Posts : 149
Join date : 2016-05-04
Location : UK

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Whippet on Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:48 am

Needle throw for lining with a rotary:

I just came across this specification for a Rotary machine:

   (Invictus Microglide Rotary)
Short 2.6mm, ideal for Black & Grey and Shading
   Medium 3.4mm, ideal for colouring and solid black
   Long 4.2mm ideal for lining and traditional colouring (whip shading)


What confuses me is that the lining specification has the longest throw (4.2mm). Can anyone explain why this is the case, as it seems contrary to conventional wisdom when lining with coils ie. short fast stroke?
avatar
Whippet

Posts : 149
Join date : 2016-05-04
Location : UK

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Ketchup Kid on Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:08 pm

i just got my rw. its a nice machine, you can tell just by holding it, like a colt .45. have not had a chance to use it. i already know its gonna be a lot like my storm but better. both no give machines with mid stroke. or maybe not

i had to dig deep and search for the answer to your question. everyone had their explanations, but it comes down to physics. the way the rotary works is you get one hit for every rpm. the rpms change, the needle is in linear motion.
force=mass * acceleration. at a given rpm, the needle comes out at the same speed, same number of times. at that set rpm, only way to increase the force is the give it more acceleration by extending the stroke length. now it is coming out the same number of times but because it is traveling a longer distance, giving it more inertia and hit. which is what you want for lining. even if you upped the speed by turning up voltage, without the longer stroke to give it more punch, it may not be suitable for lining. this is opposed to the coil that if you turn the power up will hit harder, but speed is mainly determined by springs. coil liners have fast short strokes but gotta hit faster and harder than when shading. keep in mind the ultimate stroke length is how far you set the needle to come out. and cam size just determines how fast the needle is traveling in linear motion.
avatar
Ketchup Kid

Posts : 301
Join date : 2016-05-04
Age : 37
Location : Southern West Coast U.S.A. 818/213

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Whippet on Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:06 am

I bow down before you oh wise one - good answer!!
avatar
Whippet

Posts : 149
Join date : 2016-05-04
Location : UK

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by GM74 on Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:24 am

I've used a good dfly knock off and it wobbled a bit but was strong, I ordered a second one and it was slightly different and couldn't run a mag thru butter so I took off the needle retainer and tossed it. The good dfly packed it in suddenly after about 30 hours combined use over a couple months. I have a fake ego, beast, bizarre and whip and use only the ego for soft shading. The bizarres shaft broke 5 hours combined use plastic sheared and chunks fell during a tat lol. But it was a heavy solid machine and good for lining. All these I've tried but feel I'm foolish for not paying for a half decent machine. So if you own a hummingbird with maxon or stealth 3 from worldwide please lmk your opinion. I love coils but rotary's are so much nicer and light

GM74

Posts : 25
Join date : 2016-06-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Mr.Martian on Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:58 am

Loulou wrote:if you want to spend a bit less try starr they make rotaries for under 100 quid i have just brought one to try ,


Hey Lou, what was that Starr like? Cheers
avatar
Mr.Martian

Posts : 43
Join date : 2016-05-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Loulou on Fri Jul 22, 2016 12:31 pm

mmm it was ok , i use it for dotwork a lot,, it can line but it doesn't run fast enough for me would make a nice colour packer as well
avatar
Loulou
Admin

Posts : 491
Join date : 2016-05-02

View user profile http://bestattooforum.forumotion.co.uk

Back to top Go down

Re: Decent rotary machine recommendations

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum